From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: by 10.90.27.4 with SMTP id a4cs76470aga; Wed, 9 Dec 2009 05:46:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.224.88.7 with SMTP id y7mr1190468qal.240.1260366359086; Wed, 09 Dec 2009 05:45:59 -0800 (PST) Return-Path: Received: from rubyforge.org (rubyforge.org [205.234.109.19]) by mx.google.com with ESMTP id 15si11131991qyk.91.2009.12.09.05.45.58; Wed, 09 Dec 2009 05:45:59 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of sup-talk-bounces@rubyforge.org designates 205.234.109.19 as permitted sender) client-ip=205.234.109.19; Authentication-Results: mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of sup-talk-bounces@rubyforge.org designates 205.234.109.19 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=sup-talk-bounces@rubyforge.org; dkim=neutral (body hash did not verify) header.i=@gmail.com Received: from rubyforge.org (rubyforge.org [127.0.0.1]) by rubyforge.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFA3A1D78864 for ; Wed, 9 Dec 2009 08:45:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail-bw0-f216.google.com (mail-bw0-f216.google.com [209.85.218.216]) by rubyforge.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D81091858282 for ; Wed, 9 Dec 2009 08:45:49 -0500 (EST) Received: by bwz8 with SMTP id 8so5757645bwz.19 for ; Wed, 09 Dec 2009 05:45:49 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=mN6UVAkPHGRGAPSPwcaP7lFOPSUcH7ewutM61eeH5k4=; b=l+IVVjXmElB/08ke4KOt9YE1bGOpvSU+QvsxX7QRWah+ksTvlYQJohuGlcUe6YD3ut dQZq7ywzCDHaFBRz0tfKOFu1Z0aRdjgpK23AKGWsv2CJTMuF8SQ+akVFXoBMRtFhjNNy Gq81hYOT22i6RPaz+IXz/pZ4hipTj+5PzJGjw= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=Qe3x3rY5IpSttvRDzhW9Ym/Law97ZNht6wZqQfmJfNptbcvMK4QVcGAFnlKO1fK0Vc N3g4qS+jZGSHHO/Rts0LcnI5vqJph4ZpMKlrwPNzqPzFlHO3xw2Zmx552bYuyXWdwGXQ w1VGA/L2UQudpdNOi/H5CTO1JZbxBd3EPC8dw= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.204.33.140 with SMTP id h12mr10246863bkd.167.1260366348960; Wed, 09 Dec 2009 05:45:48 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <1260323222-sup-1616@zyrg.net> References: <1260291857-sup-4773@zyrg.net> <80055d7c0912081412h483bc6dt8493b08dfab1d23b@mail.gmail.com> <1260323222-sup-1616@zyrg.net> Date: Wed, 9 Dec 2009 08:45:48 -0500 Message-ID: <80055d7c0912090545w2ac96a8cp23a8c5dedf32218f@mail.gmail.com> From: Andrei Thorp To: Rich Lane , sup-talk@rubyforge.org Subject: Re: [sup-talk] sup-server X-BeenThere: sup-talk@rubyforge.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: User & developer discussion of Sup List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: sup-talk-bounces@rubyforge.org Errors-To: sup-talk-bounces@rubyforge.org On Tue, Dec 8, 2009 at 9:33 PM, Rich Lane wrote: > Excerpts from Andrei Thorp's message of Tue Dec 08 17:12:05 -0500 2009: >> This really seems like it's in direct competition with the Wave >> system... but Wave has a lot more support. And yes, Wave doesn't have >> e-mail federation at the moment, but I think they plan to do that in >> the future. So yes, I like the idea of a Sup server, I like being able >> to access my (sup) mail from multiple computers, I like the idea of >> having multiple UIs to the Sup Service... but I think that in the long >> run, I'd feel just as good about a couple good open source UIs to >> Google's Wave instead. > > I actually didn't think about this as being competition to Wave. The > current implementation is much more narrowly scoped, Yeah, if you're sticking strictly to e-mail, this is a much better idea. > but the grand > generic document store vision does bear a resemblance. I don't know how > far down that road the project will go. The slight trouble that I foresee would be when Wave does do e-mail federation. I guess what I'm saying is that the future of this project would be reliant on whether or not Wave takes over, incorporates all of e-mail (as google seems to hope), and phases it out in the long run. I know, I know, there will be blood when this starts to happen (if it does). The reason that sup-server would have trouble if wave became popular would be simply that your e-mail would be fetched by wave servers and sup-server would not really have a place to be inserted, unless it actually became a mail server with some non-standard extensions (presumably for tagging, etc.). This might actually be an interesting direction to take regardless, actually. Upon thinking about how this might work, it seems a lot of data like annotations, labels, etc. could be stored in non-standard e-mail headers, and "sup clients" would just fetch the mail regularly and do stuff with the extra headers they have. The annotation system could, perhaps, list the line of the source + the annotation.The labels would be just a plain list. Then, you could even write back to the mail server your new headers with imap I guess? > I don't want to lose mail client > functionality for the sake of being as generic as Wave (I haven't seen > any information on the subject, but I assume the translation to/from > email is lossy). I guess we don't know whether or not it would be lossy yet. I suppose for the sake of wave internals (sending waves based on e-mails), there will have to be a lot of stuff cut, like most of the e-mail data fields (how would they know what the "to" person is when mapped to wave?). However, for the sake of sending back out to the e-mail system, they would probably store all of the relevant field data. Anyway, a lot of this is speculative, and the e-mail vs. wave battle of the future may not even happen because people are content enough with e-mail. Or it may be far off, or who knows! And I could sure use STS now to handle my mail in a sane way in the meanwhile. Foods for Thoughts, -Andrei Thorp P.S. I'll be excited for the future of sup regardless of what happens. I do honestly like this project a lot. _______________________________________________ sup-talk mailing list sup-talk@rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/sup-talk